Obviously not, if you get Oscars like Eddie Redmayne https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXKLQYcC_44 (2.5 minutes it is worth watching through)Eltonjohn wrote:If the story was ABOUT a transgender character and a cis gendered performer was cast in the role, would it matter?
transgender billy
- ERinVA
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Re: transgender billy
Ellen
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
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"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
Re: transgender billy
The UK situation is very confusing. There is categorically no law against males using the "Ladies toilet" or vice versa, in fact there is case law that the using signs saying "Ladies" and "Mens" is discriminatory (symbols are ok). However there are rules as to how many separate Male and Female loos must be provided. (incidentally the VP complied more or less if you included the disabled and ones above the grand circle, but more are in the plans for the resurected VP).
~ Paul ~
- angelenroute
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Re: transgender billy
I believe that if a 40-something-year-old actor playing Tony doesn't keep you away from seeing a great show, why should the fact that a child was born with different body parts you can't even see affect your enjoyment of the performance?
Or if a rich kid from Switzerland or Canada plays a poor kid from England, why would I care? He's playing a part. I'm paying money to see people perform a part, not prove something financially or medically about themselves.
Some people may agree with this, but they still balk. To them, I would just ask, if Annie was played by a girl who was born a boy, would you be just as upset? Maybe you would, I don't know. I just know that I would happily support any show and person in which this ever happens, and I'm sorry to hear some of you would not.
Or if a rich kid from Switzerland or Canada plays a poor kid from England, why would I care? He's playing a part. I'm paying money to see people perform a part, not prove something financially or medically about themselves.
Some people may agree with this, but they still balk. To them, I would just ask, if Annie was played by a girl who was born a boy, would you be just as upset? Maybe you would, I don't know. I just know that I would happily support any show and person in which this ever happens, and I'm sorry to hear some of you would not.
"Good writers define reality; bad ones merely restate it." -Edward Albee
Re: transgender billy
' I just know that I would happily support any show and person in which this ever happens, and I'm sorry to hear some of you would not. '
I could care less if the child actor is a wombat or a turtle - as long as he (or a she identifying as a he) plays Billy as a true triple threat. I would imagine that such gender identity information about a minor would not be publicized. Certainly not in the UK. It is of no interest to me. It is talent that counts.
Think for a moment - the era is County Durham, 1984. Let's keep the focus on the reality back then. Otherwise, the whole premise becomes confused.
I could care less if the child actor is a wombat or a turtle - as long as he (or a she identifying as a he) plays Billy as a true triple threat. I would imagine that such gender identity information about a minor would not be publicized. Certainly not in the UK. It is of no interest to me. It is talent that counts.
Think for a moment - the era is County Durham, 1984. Let's keep the focus on the reality back then. Otherwise, the whole premise becomes confused.
Re: transgender billy
Billy Elliot is different from Annie: The entire story is about the fact that a natural-born boy can dance without even having to be a "poof". If a girl played the role, it would turn the story into a complete fiction: Boys can dance, but only in stories.
The story of Annie could very easily be adapted to have a boy as the lead. Off the top of my head, the only place where it comes up is when Daddy Warbucks remarks in anger "orphans are boys!" when he finds out that it will be a girl orphan who visits. Cut that line and you're done. To make Billy a girl would either render the story nonsensical or require a complete adaptation, such as "Eltonjohn"'s idea for a girl who plays hockey in secret. Though even there, a girl who plays hockey is far more accepted than a boy who dances.
The story of Annie could very easily be adapted to have a boy as the lead. Off the top of my head, the only place where it comes up is when Daddy Warbucks remarks in anger "orphans are boys!" when he finds out that it will be a girl orphan who visits. Cut that line and you're done. To make Billy a girl would either render the story nonsensical or require a complete adaptation, such as "Eltonjohn"'s idea for a girl who plays hockey in secret. Though even there, a girl who plays hockey is far more accepted than a boy who dances.
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Re: transgender billy
Then what about color-blind casting? According to the reasoning above, some really great Billys should never have played the role because interracial families were most likely not part of the scene in 1984 Easington.kport wrote:'
Think for a moment - the era is County Durham, 1984. Let's keep the focus on the reality back then. Otherwise, the whole premise becomes confused.
Ellen
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
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Re: transgender billy
We seem to have gotten slightly off topic.LiamM wrote:Billy Elliot is different from Annie: The entire story is about the fact that a natural-born boy can dance without even having to be a "poof". If a girl played the role, it would turn the story into a complete fiction: Boys can dance, but only in stories.
The story of Annie could very easily be adapted to have a boy as the lead. Off the top of my head, the only place where it comes up is when Daddy Warbucks remarks in anger "orphans are boys!" when he finds out that it will be a girl orphan who visits. Cut that line and you're done. To make Billy a girl would either render the story nonsensical or require a complete adaptation, such as "Eltonjohn"'s idea for a girl who plays hockey in secret. Though even there, a girl who plays hockey is far more accepted than a boy who dances.
This topic is not about girls playing boys' roles or vice versa in productions such as Annie, etc. It's about a boy--specifically a transgender boy-- playing a boy's role--specifically the role of Billy. If a boy is genuinely transgender, as far as he, his family and his doctors are concerned, he is a boy, so why should he not be able to play Billy if he is the right age and has the acting/singing/dancing skills to fulfill the role?
Ellen
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
Re: transgender billy
I knew some interracial families in the Midlands in 1984. It was not unknown at the time. TG pre-adolescents were not even on the radar.ERinVA wrote:Then what about color-blind casting? According to the reasoning above, some really great Billys should never have played the role because interracial families were most likely not part of the scene in 1984 Easington.kport wrote:'
Think for a moment - the era is County Durham, 1984. Let's keep the focus on the reality back then. Otherwise, the whole premise becomes confused.
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Re: transgender billy
So... How are audience members going to be able to identify a prepubescent transgender Billy up there on stage?
Ellen
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
- ERinVA
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Re: transgender billy
Are we sure that the character of Michael isn't actually transgender? As you say, it "wasn't on the radar" in 1984, but the condition certainly existed ( think The Danish Girl, for example), and I'm sure there were many people who would have greatly desired to medically transition if they had known they could. But such a thing was unavailable to all but a very few, and most assuredly not for the faint-hearted. Even today, the process is arduous, even if begun at an early age, and especially at an early age, takes a great deal of support and commitment from the child's family to help the child live as authentically as possible. In other words, to "always be him/herself.".kport wrote:
I knew some interracial families in the Midlands in 1984. It was not unknown at the time. TG pre-adolescents were not even on the radar.
And where have we heard that message before?
Ellen
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.
"I don't want people who want to dance; I want people who have to dance.”
-George Balanchine 1904 -1983
To follow the forum's Twitter at http://twitter.com/BEForum, click on the direct link in Applies to All Forums above.